Canoe with a View : : Canadian Open Canoe forum

anyone recommend any Paddling/hammocking places north of manchester, or near manchester?
Cumbria, or somewhere nearer maybe...

Peel Island along the East Shore of Coniston would be a good spot BB. Seems to be a popular wild camping spot but probably quiet at this time of the year, plenty of trees which appear to be of appropriate hammock stringing dimensions.

For something completely different (The Ministry of Silly Paddles?) what about Piel Island off the coast at Roa Island (just outside of Barrow in Furness), probably not so good for Hammocking, but it's all common land with free camping. There's even a pub! Although it's probably closed for the season now. In addition there's a brilliant little castle and the opportunity to paddle across to South Walney to the seal colony. If you do choose this option remember to stay out of the deep water channel lest you end up playing chicken with one of the Nuclear Waste Ships. However should it all go toes up the Lifeboat Station is very handy.
Andy (Cumbria).

I would dissuade you from spending the night on Piel Isle. South Lakeland National Park Authority & South Lakeland District Council have been posting signs for the past four year, that direct you, to not camp and or do not light fires on Piel Isle. Pulling up a canoe/kayak and spending the night under such circumstances, is going to do little, to further access to such places. And can only serve to damage both the island and the already restricted access to such places.

TGB

(13-10-09 10:51 AM)TGB Wrote: [ -> ] I would dissuade you from spending the night on Piel Isle. South Lakeland National Park Authority & South Lakeland District Council have been posting signs for the past four year, that direct you, to not camp and or do not light fires on Piel Isle. Pulling up a canoe/kayak and spending the night under such circumstances, is going to do little, to further access to such places. And can only serve to damage both the island and the already restricted access to such places.

TGB

In a similar way to riparian owners sticking up signs indicating that paddling on a river is trespass, so we shouldn't paddle on them..

Somehow, I don't think a camper as responsible as BB is going to leave any sign at all that he was there....

Cheers
Red.

TGB you are correct; SLDC, The National Trust, National Parks Authority and even Cumbria Constabulary have littered the car parks footpaths and lakesides of Cumbria with Do Not Camp notices. In addition the Property and Land Owners of this region have erected their own plethera of Bugger Off, don't even think abot coming anywhere near my land signs.

In so many ways I can see why this has occured, the litter, the noise and wanton or selfish desecration of our environmental heraitage has brought about this response.

As a man who is conformist by nature I am generally inclined to agree with the restrictions imposed on the masses to effectively manage the excesses of the few. For the most part there are ways to either circumnavigate these restrictions or alternatives which achieve the same or a similar outcome

In this situation I am not sure that there is an alternative solution and maybe the time has come for the quiet conformists to take a stand. Maybe it's time for those of us who cherish the outdoors and all that it teaches us (and our families) to reclaim it one pitch, paddle or walk at a time.

For many years football hooliganism has been a massive problem in the UK, with fans from opposing teams travelling throughout the country to battle with their rivals, resulting in physical, financial and emotional damage to the communities which they invaded. Were football fans stopped en mass from travelling to other grounds? No, they were policed, enabling the genuine football fan to continue to follow their team and relying upon the authorities to identify and manage the thugs and hoodolums. Maybe this is the solution we require for wild campers in the UK/England, stop the blanket ban, improve policing and chastise the wrong doers.

I read on one of the other threads on this site about the restriction of wild camping in Scotland and the appointment of desiganted wild/informal camping areas. Maybe this is a good strting point for England, providing the Authorities with a defined area to manage who would no doubt be fully supported by the genuine wild campers in the identification of wrong doers??

My final query ~ what would the Right to Roam Activists of times gone by make of the current state of affairs. Do we continue to be the silent conformists or do we move the cause forward??

I am not against 'wild camping', nor do I have a problem with paddling rivers or ww runs. But Piel Isle is a very small piece of land, with a finite amount of soil, sparse stabilising growth and very, very little re-growth of any kind. People wandering about and climbing on it is tough enough. But when people camp, there tends to be a great deal of movement in a small space. Add to this, the probable insertion of tent pegs & the associated loosening of soil when they are removed and life for the isle gets harder still. I know of the advantages of soil aeration but in this case, pegs and the like will only further degrade an already fragile environment. There are plenty of places to camp locally, either at regulated campsites or just away from the shore but still close to the water's edge. Where time for recovery of the land, in particular, the very near vicinity, will be greatly increased and damage much reduced. If the isle was much bigger, with a thriving habitat, I would see no problem but it's tiny with a rapidly declining habitat.

Which would you prefer, Piel Isle with trees, bugs, grasses, mosses and a few nesting birds? Or a nearly bare lump of rock, with lichens and a few moss clumps? - I know not everybody does it. But the cumulative affect, will only be a detriment to an already fragile environment. I am not advocating you stop visiting the isle; it's a grand place for a brew, rest or lunch. Just go with care and please don't camp.

TGB

Just be careful of any bye laws that you may not know about

Hiya


> anyone recommend any Paddling/hammocking places north of manchester, or near manchester?
To stay on topic, sorry no I cannot help.

Waaaay off topic, you have set me musing...

(23-10-09 11:01 PM)cumbria Wrote: [ -> ]As a man who is conformist by nature I am generally inclined to agree with the restrictions imposed on the masses to effectively manage the excesses of the few.

Thereby letting the actions of the few allow TPTB to use them as an excuse for social control.

This really is a tricky one for me, on one hand we have people holding raves on other peoples land, people moving in with caravans and not moving out or the general public blundering about leaving gates open and rubbish every where.

On the other hand we have land/water even mountain owners who would have absolutely no access to their land etc. Even if the land is what passes for wild in the UK. Of course large landowners wield power financially and politically and would happily walk over our rights if they could.
in fact many do, blocking rights of way, bullying and threatening.

In my experience if you get more than a mile from a road or car park you will usually find people who respect the environment that they are in, ie us :-) but we are the few and laws are made to cover the many.

For me I believe that I am a sensible adult who causes no harm when wild camping and somehow I think that our rights to enjoy nature should be defended. The catch is the more fuss we make the more landowners panic about how many of us there are. Keep a low profile is my current motto.

Blindly following rules is not my way, if we all did so rulemakers would just keep churning them out. If the mass trespass of Kinder Scout had not taken place we would not have much freedom in the hills.

Actually as I type I am getting more millitant.... I did my bit in the forces for nine years and feel that I have earned a stake in my country.

Hmmmmmm, OK my conclusion is that there are too many people in the country and not enough room, I need all people that I do not personally approve of to leave now! (CwaV members are automatically approved)

Musing over... still confused :-(

I agree Baggy,

Generally, the worst you get for trespass is an angry landowner shouting abuse at you...(As Gill and Mark experienced). The best way to deal with this is ignore it and leave by the quickest route possible (in our case, this will most often be via the water), as the minute you respond it can turn into Aggrevated Trespass, and where Trespass is a civil matter, I believe (could be wrong) AT is a a criminal matter...

IMO keeping a low profile, respecting the land, ignore unofficial signage, and doing your own thing is, the way forward....

Cheers
Red.

(13-10-09 05:49 PM)redframe Wrote: [ -> ][quote='TGB' pid='22894' dateline='1255431117']
I would dissuade you from spending the night on Piel Isle.



Somehow, I don't think a camper as responsible as BB is going to leave any sign at all that he was there....

Cheers
Red.

No of course not BB is a resonsible camper and would leave no Sign of being there, even burning the signs left by spoil sports.
Regards Bill

(30-06-10 04:53 PM)Canalvoyageur Wrote: [ -> ]....even burning the signs left by spoil sports.

PMSL.... Nice one Bill....

Cheers
Red.